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My Left Nutmeg

New Open Thread: Judiciary Committee Hearings on Marriage Equality

by: Maura

Mon Mar 26, 2007 at 17:46:09 PM EDT


100 comments in, MLN's slowing down a bit so I thought I'd create a new open thread for anyone who's following the hearings at CT-N, or if reading live-blog rough transcripts helps you to follow the arguments.

Watch history being made online today!


...or if you're just coming home from work, tune in!  This is some of the best political drama we'll see all year.  Please join us in the comments for your reaction and discussion.

Big shout out to Rep. Walker, Rep. Tong and Sen. Gomes for excellent questioning, and of course Sen McDonald and Rep. Lawlor for doing such a great job of chairing this important hearing. 

Who else is standing out, in your opinion?

UPDATE: Woo hoo!  We just got a shout-out on CT-N from Mike Lawlor.  Love that guy.
Maura :: New Open Thread: Judiciary Committee Hearings on Marriage Equality
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New Open Thread: Judiciary Committee Hearings on Marriage Equality | 118 comments
"Your linens, Mr. Brown" (4.00 / 1)
Toni Walker just stopped half a step away from dropping a stack of white sheets on Brian Brown's lap. "We were burned out of our house by people carrying bibles just like you." Ouch.

–7.25 / –7.28 | http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/tw...
I don't want to miss anything (0.00 / 0)
But I'm done at work and want to get over to the hearing. Such a dilemma. Do we know who's up after Mr. FIC?
[ Parent ]
Not sure but... (0.00 / 0)
...if I remember correctly based on one of the chairs who  mentioned there were 75 people waiting to testify, I think there have got to be at least 50 left.  It's going to be a late night, like the Plan B hearings.

Do you have a laptop you can take there to live-blog from?  That would be cool.  The LOB is Wi-Fi ready.

[ Parent ]
I wish I had brought my laptop with me! (0.00 / 0)
I could go get it and then hit the hearing, but I'd miss a lot more of it... Hmm. I'm new to this whole blogging thing. Will anyone care if I'm there with a laptop typing away?
[ Parent ]
No (0.00 / 0)
That's why the wireless is there. 
[ Parent ]
OK, then (0.00 / 0)
I'll run home and grab my laptop and some food and hopefully be live blogging within the hour. No promises to stay until the complete bitter end, though. I hope I can get a seat in the actual hearing room instead of the overflow room.
[ Parent ]
It's totally fine to type (0.00 / 0)
Just don't let your cell phone ring. 

Oh, and based on experience -- stop by a store and grab a couple of drinks and a snack before you go there.  It's gonna be a long night!

[ Parent ]
What Maura Said (0.00 / 0)
Rations are should be a part of any hearing survival kit.
[ Parent ]
And BTW (0.00 / 0)
Welcome to blogging!!!!
[ Parent ]
So far... (0.00 / 0)
...that's the most dramatic and memorable exchange from the hearing thus far.
[ Parent ]
I'm downloading Walker's now (0.00 / 0)
Wow, Rep. Meyer is ripping into Brown now. Mr. FIC is redder than a strawberry now..
[ Parent ]
Walker/Brown exchange (another classic moment) (4.00 / 1)
Walker_Brown


[ Parent ]
Brian Brown is getting annoyed... (0.00 / 0)
Check out the eye rolling!!
As a Roman Catholic... (0.00 / 0)
...I would just like to say that asking a person about their beliefs doesn't mean you are trying to abrogate their free speech.

Obviously, Mike Lawlor isn't trying to interere with Brian Brown's speech.  He's speaking now.

LAWLOR: Labeling people as intrinsically evil and objectively disordered is respectful?

Rock on, Mike!!!!!

Now that we seemed focus on the issue of us Catholics... (0.00 / 0)
...I move that we re-call the witness who was talking about some conspiracy to murder all the liberal popes.  That was the  most fun testimony all day!
Maura rocks & question to ask (0.00 / 0)
Who else is standing out, in your opinion?

Maura rocks!  Thanks for the public service typing.

Someone should ask Brian Brown if FIC supports repealing the existing sexual orientation employment discrimination laws.  No one ever asks that question.

Thanks, Mike!!!! (0.00 / 0)

[ Parent ]
ARRGH, what kind of a question...??? (0.00 / 0)
MORRIS: Are the teachings of the Church protected under the law, yes or no?

BROWN: Yes, but they're under attack

MORRIS: Rep. Lawlor asked if homosexuals are intrinsically evil or objectively disordered.  Are you saying that about the individuals or the behavior?

BROWN:  I was emphatic...The Church is a church of charity, of love, we're in the middle of Lent...

MORRIS:  ...when we start having a discussion about sin in a public place, everyone shouldn't shudder...is the basis of your position your Catholic doctorine or position on homosexuality or something else?

BROWN:  ...based on the logical definitional (??)...As a Catholic I believe what the Catholic Church teaches...

Brian Brown closing exchanges (0.00 / 0)
[ Parent ]
Capt. Amy Pear, Haddam (0.00 / 0)
speaking in favor of the bill

PEAR:  ...I have spent the last 18 years of my life protecting and serving the public with the Middletown Police Department...worked as a narcotics officer...spouse would have to go to sleep alone at night not knowing what the morning would bring...I had some frustrating moments, she stood by me, that's what spouses do.  ...I did not want to settle for a solution that was not equal to marriage.  ...due to the danger of my job, we decided to have a civil union...to protect our family in the event that I die in the line of duty.

Rep. Lawlor to Pear (0.00 / 0)
LAWLOR:  You've been a leader in the law enforcement community...did you want to plug your own web site?

GOAL New England  (Gay Officers Action League)

[ Parent ]
Amy Pear testimony (0.00 / 0)
[ Parent ]
Roger Vann, ACLU of CT (0.00 / 0)
(just highlight)

"historically, separate is never equal"

(damn, this is great testimony, but my fingers are cold and too slow to keep up with him!)

Dr. Thomas Finn, psychologist, Southington (0.00 / 0)
(opposed to bills seeking redefinition of marriage)

Opposes the bill based on science...the studies cited have been based on design flaws...when we are told that studies show no negative effects on children raised by same-gender parents, they are usually compared to single mothers...small number of children studied is not significant...the only valid conclusions we can draw is that scientific standards have been lowered and we still don't know enough....

Thomas Finn testimony (0.00 / 0)

Finn
Uploaded by ctblogger

[ Parent ]
Dan McCann (0.00 / 0)
Longtime opponent of same-sex marriage, object to this institution trying to change a social construct that has been in place for over 3000 years...this same committee, without a referendum, instituted civil unions...this committee is attempting to redefine the definition of marriage...why would you not consider to let the people of Connecticut decide this?...distortions that gay and lesbian people have brought to this discussion... Many of the people who oppose same-sex marriage, such as in the African-American community, are appalled that this has been compared to civil rights... where is it posted that there is a heterosexual bathroom only?  Where is it posted that there is heterosexual seating on a bus?  The fact of the matter is none of this exist...government should never been involved in our bedrooms...

Dude, when was government getting in your bedroom and trying to get you to accept anything?

Do people need a basic civics class to know that we have a representative democracy here in Connecticut?  Laws don't get passed by referendum!  What is the obsession with referenda?

LAWLOR:  WE didn't require everyone in Connecticut to get a civil union, right?

LAWLOR:  You're aware we all have to stand for election every two years, right?

LAWLOR:  You understand all the laws that get passed get passed without a referendum, right?

(Rock on, Mike.)

Go Rep Gomes (0.00 / 0)
Dude, this Dan McCann is going to try to argue with Ed Gomes about what constitutes discrimination??? 
[ Parent ]
Daniel McCann: the voice of the African-American community (4.00 / 1)
LOL.
[ Parent ]
Heh (0.00 / 0)
What, you weren't at the interview when he was hired as spokesman?
[ Parent ]
Now I understand... (0.00 / 0)
why Dan McCann lost the election to Lawlor.

With Republicans candidates like McCann, I also understand why the Democrats are in the super majority.

[ Parent ]
McDonald to McCann (0.00 / 0)
McDonald: Do you consider DADT to be discriminatory policy?

McCann: It goes to morale of the troops...

McDonald: Do you think that that policy has a discriminatory effect on those who are homosexual?

McCann: It may, it may, but I really can't comment on that

McDonald: Do you consider the federal defense of marriage act to be discriminatory?

McCann: It allows states to make its own marriage laws

McDonald: If I told you that the federal defense of marriage act prevents

McCann: Massachusetts is different because MA was handed down by decree of the court...

Dude, this guy is clueless.  It's not even worth typing this...he just is uninformed.

[ Parent ]
So this is Mike Lawlor's opponent???? (0.00 / 0)
Oh, Mike, you gotta pray this guy runs against you forever.  You'll have your seat for life!  It's *so* not a fair fight to put this joker up against you.  You could beat him with both hands tied behind your back, and half a lobotomy to boot.

[ Parent ]
background on McCann (0.00 / 0)
For context, McCann ran twice against Mike Lawlor and was wildly unsuccessful.  The Family Institute paid for bulletin board ads in his district that said "Protect Marriage Vote McCann"  and "A vote for Mike Lawlor is a vote for same-sex `marriage' ...period."
[ Parent ]
Sparky shouldn't have to break a sweat... (0.00 / 0)
...against this silly, silly man. 

"Have you seen anyone be visually discriminated against for being Irish Catholic?"  What on earth????

[ Parent ]
McCann testimony (0.00 / 0)

[ Parent ]
Hello from the LOB (4.00 / 2)
Finally got a seat next to an outlet, so now I can blog! I caught the very last part of McCann's testimony... There was a lot of seat shifting and eye rolling in the audience on that one. There are currently about 40 people in the room, but at least 10 people left when the non-marriage bill testimony started a few minutes ago.

This woman's kids are wicked cute, and they are well-behaved. Too bad they had to sit around all day for her testimony on the wrong side of the issue... And hello, this hearing was advertised as scheduled. And people can submit written testimony, doesn't matter if they can phone in their opinion on an issue...

And I'm new at this whole thing-- (0.00 / 0)
so let me know what kind of stuff y'all are interested in knowing.
[ Parent ]
Thanks (0.00 / 0)
Of the people who are left, how many are wearing the yellow equality stickers?

BTW, what do the white anti-equality stickers actually say?

(At the Plan B hearing, I was stunned that the opponents' stickers read "Plan B = Medical Rape".  It was so grossly offensive.  Obscene, really.  So I'm wondering what they came up wtih this time.)

[ Parent ]
Woo hoo! (0.00 / 0)
It's great to have you there on the scene to give us some local flavor...I'm a little petered out on typing myself!
[ Parent ]
Anna Heller from COLAGE (0.00 / 0)
Here's the link to COLAGE, Children of Lesbians & Gays Everywhere.  Great web site, great testimony.
Rep. Bye to Heller (0.00 / 0)
BYE: What's your reaction to sitting here and hearing testimony that same-sex marriage harms children?

HELLER: (essentially) not having marriage is what harms them

[ Parent ]
Ann Heller testimony (0.00 / 0)

[ Parent ]
Anna Heller (4.00 / 2)
Co-founder of COLLAGE (no E on that? someone look it up), group of children of lesbians and gays... Still told they are not the same... Marriage is an institution and children need to feel like and be told they are a part of that institution, that they are like everyone else and their relationships are like those of everyone else... Mother taught her to treat people with respect at an early age... Wants government to recognize that her family deserves the same protection, respect as all others... She is straight and feels she shouldn't have more rights than her mother does...
There are a few older couples sitting near me (0.00 / 0)
who keep kind of snorting under their breath at her comments, as if she's lying about being proud of her mom. Not impressive.

Several names have been called and the people are not here to testify... Seriously, McDonald has called like 8 names and counting...

[ Parent ]
Great stuff (0.00 / 0)
That kind of flavor -- knowing that some jerks are snorting at that great testimony -- is so fun to know!

So where in the room are you sitting?  Can we see you on screen?

Make sure you go over and say hi to Rep. Lawlor when the hearing is over.

[ Parent ]
I'm not on screen (0.00 / 0)
I'm in the corner of the room to McDonald's right side. Seems to be mostly a section for opponents of the bill. I got funny looks when I came over here, but several of the other outlets were taken.
[ Parent ]
Mark Dost (0.00 / 0)
Lawyer in Waterbury, member of elder law, probate, trusts and estates sections of CT Bar Association. BUT he's here testifying for himself, not the CBA (phew, I was about to have to start writing nasty emails to the CBA, of which I am a member).

Against converting marriages in MA, Canada, etc to civil unions in CT (raised bill 1449). Would impair the policy of this state limiting marital recognition to one man and one woman.

Huh? If CT has a policy of allowing civil unions, why would this hurt that policy? I don't get it.

Questions (0.00 / 0)
Great back and forth between Dost and McDonald about why we wouldn't recognize a foreign same-sex marriage as at least a civil union here under full faith and credit, especially since apparently the NJ AG has said in NJ they would be civil unions, so what about if a MA couple who got married to stop over in NJ, get recognized as a civil union, and then came here?

I really don't understand this testimony. If the CT legislature decided civil unions are legal, why would we force an MA couple who got married to then come here and what, refile to get a civil union? Would they have to first dissolve their marriage? Why why why?

[ Parent ]
Mark Dost testimony (0.00 / 0)

Dost
Uploaded by ctblogger

[ Parent ]
LMF wins the sticker war (4.00 / 1)
Their stickers are the bright yellow circles, with EQUALITY in big bold letters. The opponents of the bill are wearing white circles that say MARRIAGE and then underneath "One Man, One Woman." You can barely read the white stickers b/c the font is not bold and is too small. Tactical error, Ric. Tactical error.
That should have read (0.00 / 0)
"Tactical error, FIC." Whoops.
[ Parent ]
Random sticker question (0.00 / 0)
What is the bottom sticker on the woman testifying now?...it looks different than the other one.
[ Parent ]
I've been outed (4.00 / 2)
as a blogger. Mike Lawlor just walked over and introduced himself to me. How cool is it that he's reading all of this during the hearing??
I can't say enough good about Mike Lawlor! n/t (0.00 / 0)

[ Parent ]
This is pretty cool stuff (0.00 / 0)
I don't know if this type of liveblogging interaction has ever happened before in any hearing in any state legislature, but I can't imagine it has.
[ Parent ]
I really like him too. (0.00 / 0)
So cool that he would go say hi to someone live blogging in the hearing room! He's great.
[ Parent ]
Rev Tumicki (0.00 / 0)
Oh, he brought NAMBLA into it... Come on! Upset about the age disparity permitted in the bill b/c it permits some form of sexual abuse of minors.

"My shock deepens"... Very dramatic words being used.

Which legislators are still in the room? (0.00 / 0)
In particular, is Rep. Adinolfi still there?  He's always good for a few laughs...Rev. Morris must be gone since I haven't heard any theological questions in over an hour.
[ Parent ]
Yep (0.00 / 0)
Adinolfi is still here. McDonald, Kissel, Fox, Gomes, Tong, Morris, Bye, and a woman next to Adinolfi whose name I don't know. Lawlor left a few moments ago, I'm sure he'll be back shortly. Some of the other legislators' spots (Rowe, Coleman, and Walker) that I can se still have open binders and papers all over, so I think they're still here. Geragosian was here when I came in, I'm not sure when he left.
[ Parent ]
Ooh goody (0.00 / 0)
Maybe we can get some questions about marrying flags and bars of chocolate, then.
[ Parent ]
Woah, this priest... (0.00 / 0)
...did not just play the NAMBLA card, did he???

That's even more "out there" than the guy who talked about marrying dolphins.

I don't think I can be the only one who finds irony in this guy pontificating about the CT legislature failing to prevent the sexual abuse of children.

I think dolphins and NAMBLA (0.00 / 0)
are really like comparing apples and oranges. Or same-sex rights and racial rights. Totally different.

Rep Lawlor said earlier that he loves that hearings like this provide the opportunity to really see the spectrum of people who are for and against a bill like this. He's right--not everyone is a crazy on the side against this bill, but it's the ones who bring in the dolphins and NAMBLA who really just ruin the sane debate aspect of the whole thing.

[ Parent ]
Tumicki and NAMBLA .... (0.00 / 0)
aren't apples and oranges, though!

Sorry, but the dude is so, so gayyyyyy.

[ Parent ]
This priest is good for a hoot.... (0.00 / 0)
...love of country, love of flags, love of chocolate.

Sure, this bill becomes law and all of a sudden people are going to be getting engaged to Charleston Chews. 

[ Parent ]
I DO love chocolate. (0.00 / 0)
Not sure I'd want to marry it, though. I'm really trying to lose some weight.
[ Parent ]
Tell me this Preist is straight (4.00 / 1)
and I've got a bridge to sell you.

Being as repressed as this guy is must really be uncomfortable.

[ Parent ]
Ah, the definition of marriage according to the RC church (0.00 / 0)
And the relationship between Jesus and the church? Huh? Jesus loves the church... OK... Kind of a no brainer...

MORRIS: Are gender roles important to the church?

Again, WHAT?

[ Parent ]
Rev. Ted (4.00 / 2)
is anyone's gaydar going off with him?
I'm getting a rather strong gaydar ping (4.00 / 2)
overshadowed a bit by a eunuch hum
[ Parent ]
TOTALLY (4.00 / 2)
I didn't want to be the first one to say it.  :-)
[ Parent ]
Have a heart, guys (4.00 / 1)
It's gotta be rough...
[ Parent ]
Did you say rough? (4.00 / 3)
Sorry, I just keep getting this picture in my mind of all Teds aunts telling his Mom how "special" Teddy was when he was a kid.
[ Parent ]
ROTFLMAO (0.00 / 0)
This is too much.
[ Parent ]
There are two men (0.00 / 0)
in the room in full robes--I'm a bad Catholic--are they friars? Brothers? But one is carrying a handheld videocamera and a separate mic and taping parts of this testimony. The other is just sitting in the audience.

BTW, there are now 53 people in the room (excluding the committee members and their clerks).

Wow (0.00 / 0)
That's a huge crowd for such a late hour.

I can't believe we're getting into the relationship between Jesus and the Church here.  I really can't believe it.  All the dozens of hours we spent trying to get Rev. Morris elected, I never imagined he'd be spending all this legislative time on theological issues.  Ugh.

[ Parent ]
I'm trying to figure out (0.00 / 0)
the balance of stickers in the audience. I think right now it's pretty equal--but there are five or six people who I don't see stickers on.
[ Parent ]
AAAUUUUUGHHHH (0.00 / 0)
Would someone PLEASE step in and make the point that Connecticut law does NOT follow Catholic Church teaching on marriage???

For instance, Catholic teaching does NOT recognize divorce or allow remarriage after divorce.

Our state does.

It's PREPOSTEROUS for Rev. Morris to waste time asking whether he feels the state is overreaching by "redefining" marriage differently than the Catholic Church does.  The State ALREADY does that. 

This is not the State of Catholicism.  This is the state of Connecticut.

OMG>>>>>>>>>Rev. Morris sat through the whole Plan B hearings and he STILL calls Plan B "chemical abortion"????????

Deep breaths, Maura (0.00 / 0)
Rep Fox has your back. "There are some people who are married who are not Catholic, correct?" Ha.
[ Parent ]
Come on, Jerry Fox (0.00 / 0)
Thank you for trying to separate the religious definition from the civil definition.  Talk about divorce, Jerry!
[ Parent ]
Rep Fox (4.00 / 1)
FOX: There is a difference for me between being married in a church and being married for state purposes. . . . If you look at a civil marriage and  a civil union, what's the distinction?

TUMICKI: The DOMA language is the distinction.

FOX: Any other distinction?

TUMICKI: The age thing he pointed out earlier...

FOX: Trying to get to a way to define/discuss this without bringing religion into it...

TUMICKI: You're changing the definition...

FOX: [forgot the question]

TUMICKI: If we say we should respect one another, we can have philosophical and theological argument, can approach it from two sides (huh?). But his point is that you can have a religious point of view and a secular point of view and come out the sam eway on this.

Overall, not a bad exchange on how to approach this question, distinction between religious and civil marriage. More on point than Morris's questions...

[ Parent ]
C'mon, mention NAMBLA again. (0.00 / 0)
The Rev. is sounding too rational at the moment.

Ah, Kissel called to say good night to his two little guys, flipping between SpongeBob and this hearing. Chuckles all around... Kissel says we're getting bogged down in racial and religious issues today.

[ Parent ]
Kissel (0.00 / 0)
KISSEL: This is a very interesting issue b/c all of the rights have been conferred, pretty much...

OK, that "pretty much" is a big deal. "Pretty much" is not totally conferred.

KISSEL: To my mind, if we take out the religious issue, then this fundamentally comes down to an issue about children, b/c we can't confer any more rights as a state than we already have. ... Ample testimony about how children of same-sex couples are fine; testimony from one of the psychiatrists that the jury is out on this...

Genghis, did you really vote for this guy? He says he knows how your district feels... Very traditional, very religious, etc.

[ Parent ]
Rev. Tumicki/Rep. Fox exchange (0.00 / 0)
[ Parent ]
Catholic Marriage? (0.00 / 0)
According to the Catholic Church, the definition of marriage does not include: 

- Catholics who refuse to have children
- A Catholic and a non-Catholic who haven't agreed to raise their children Catholic

So if we only married people according to the laws of the Catholic Church, only Catholics would be married.

Thank you Reverend Ted, you can leave now.


[ Parent ]
Sen Kissel is a smart guy (0.00 / 0)
I don't often agree with his end conclusions, but I appreciate him pointing out that we're getting bogged down in theology...and that he ought not go to battle with Sen. Gomes on civil rights.  :-)
Sen Smartypants (0.00 / 0)
I love that Sen. Kissel referenced Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God.  When I taught American Lit to high schoolers, I LOVED doing this sermon with the kids.  My favorite part:

We find it easy to step on and crush a worm that we see crawling on the earth; likewise it is easy for us to cut a slender thread that anything hangs by: therefore it easy for God, when He pleases, to throw His enemies down into hell.

What are we, that we should think that we can stand before Him, at whose rebuke the earth trembles, and before whom the mountains collapse?

Reportedly, his parishoners fainted and swooned and cried in terror at this sermon, so my kids would all compete to deliver it in as scary or dramatic a fashion as possible.  It was great fun.

[ Parent ]
Yeah, he's not one of the crazies. (0.00 / 0)
Which makes me scared of him. But I guess this is all about debate, so it's healthy.

KISSEL: Do you believe that the father and mother ideal is the goal of society... Or do you feel that a same-sex, loving couple can raise a child in an appropriate, loving environment, well-adjusted, etc...? B/c I'm hearing both sides on this issue, it's somthing that I really think is important here.

TUMICKI: Has a problem with separating marriage from child-rearing... And since you said to leave religion out of this...

KISSEL: Well, yes, b/c I just can't in my heart of hearts believe that

Kissel just gave a shout out to Anne Stanback and LMF! Woot!

KISSEL: We as a state are basically holding back only the word marriage at this point--what's the big downside to just granting the word, as well?

TUMICKI: Marriage as an institution, always about a man and woman, always about raising children, this is bigger than CT...

KISSEL: Again, you just went back to the issue of children... That's where objectively, other than the historical issue, this argument really comes down to.

[ Parent ]
He's a worthy opponent (0.00 / 0)
Some of the folks on the other side - like the guy who ran against Lawlor - are almost kinda sad, if they didn't take up so much time.  But Kissel is no slouch.  He's smart.

I wish he'd quit it with the horse and the barn door, though.  :-)

[ Parent ]
Kissel is starting to sound squishy on this issue... (0.00 / 0)

[ Parent ]
We should separate (0.00 / 0)
civil and religious marriage. 

The state should only recognize civil marriage performed by a civil judge / justice of the peace. 

Those who want a religious marriage can follow their civil ceremony with a religious ceremony in the church of their choice, if that church thinks they qualify.

I think Gomes would agree with you. (0.00 / 0)
At least based on what he's saying right now.
[ Parent ]
That's my stance (0.00 / 0)
I've come to believe that, too.  I mean, if you look just at this exchange here, there's all this wasted time trying to reconcile state statute with one particular denomination's definition of marriage.  We live in a state with relgious plurality, and there's no way state statute is ever going to conform with every sect's view of marriage.

Oooh...Rep. Morris on the tubes!!!!!

[ Parent ]
Crowd is thinning out (0.00 / 0)
We lost two opponents of the bill when Morris started speaking. Seriously, one of them said "Not this guy again," and they left a minute later. Yikes.
Thinning out even more (0.00 / 0)
We're down to 36 people. And now the balance is definitely in favor of the yellow stickers, by a large margin.
[ Parent ]
McDonald just walked in with a plastic Solo cup (0.00 / 0)
I wonder if he's drinking yet?

(I wouldn't blame him.)

Now Gomes has the same cup... (0.00 / 0)
Maybe there's spiked punch in one of their offices?
[ Parent ]
Interesting (0.00 / 0)
This priest is contradicting what I was taught as a kid in the church -- he says "feelings have no moral value", but I was also taught that "impure thoughts" were venial sins.  Maybe there's a differentiation between an inclination and a thought, but when I was little, most of my confessions were about my bad thoughts, not deeds.  I was a good kid, but I was still bogged down with having to confess covetousness, anger, wishing my big brother would step in dog poop, etc.

Oh, now we've got Rev. Adinolfi talking about Greek love!  This should be good.

Ohmigod. Adinolfi talking about.. (0.00 / 0)
Eros and Agape as it applies to acting v. thinking re: homosexuality.

Rest assured, Adinolfi understands the difference!

Oh man, I can't wait for the edited video.

Was I the only one (4.00 / 1)
to catch Lawlor's hello to MLN?
That was a hello to me! (4.00 / 1)
Woohoo, I just started blogging with you guys and I'm now your official representative. Gotta love the blogosphere. :)
[ Parent ]
Hey, we're a meritocracy here (0.00 / 0)
You write great stuff, you're one of us!  :-)  We're really lucky to have you in the room.
[ Parent ]
You're a GEM (0.00 / 0)
for doing this!
[ Parent ]
Hope you stay awhile (0.00 / 0)
Welcome! You are proving to be good at this. Maybe you could post some diaries here after this liveblog.

The arc of history is long, but it bends toward justice. --Martin Luther King, Jr.
[ Parent ]
We've got a conspiracy theorist in the house (0.00 / 0)
Joan HAUGEN: We need to stop the gay agenda. Seriously, now. It's diluting my marriage.

OK, that was snarky, I shouldn't be rude. But she is a super opponent of the bill, as evidenced by her TWO white stickers.

Right-wing moonbats airing it out on Cable TV.... (0.00 / 0)
Absolutely Priceless!

Joan Hauger, (talking about normal), "And I would offer that word gay. That word used to mean "happy, or jovial". Now that word means a homosexual man. That was a word. And now that word's meaning has been changed."  LMAO.

[ Parent ]
Ummm... (0.00 / 0)
She's offended by the fact that the word "gay" now has a different meaning than it used to. And one woman sitting in the front row couldn't help herself, she laughed out loud.
[ Parent ]
Teh gay, teh gay! (4.00 / 1)
They're steealing our worrrds!!!!  Pretty soon we'll have no words left; they'll all be homosexual, too!!!

(Item #472 on the official Homosexual Agenda:  Steal words.)

[ Parent ]
Forget it (4.00 / 1)
I meant to be rude. She feels discriminated against for her religious beliefs. Great. I don't discriminate against them, I just don't think they should affect ME.
[ Parent ]
Hey, Lawlor just gave a shout-out to MLN... (0.00 / 0)
Live and on the air.

He then commented that these hearing were giving CT a good chance to see both sides of this debate, (both sane and wing-nut), and that they would stay there as late as they needed to.

Rational vs. irrational (0.00 / 0)
intelligent vs. ignorant
brave vs. cowardly
empathy vs. callousness
Spazeboy vs. Brian Brown
Love Makes a Family vs. Family Institute of CT
MLN vs. GOP

The arc of history is long, but it bends toward justice. --Martin Luther King, Jr.
[ Parent ]
AUUUGH (4.00 / 1)
How would anyone else getting married interfere with this woman's spiritual relationship?????

What about same-sex couples who have been together as long as she has, who also made solemn vows to each other, whose union has also been blessed by God in their church?  Who is she to say that is not "marriage"? 

Who says that we who support gay marriage don't believe in a sovereign God?  "From what I see on TV and in the news...they don't really want to tell anyone to tell them what to do and how to live...at the expense of the greater good."

How does MORE people wanting to be in loving, committed, monogamous relationships in any way interfere with the common good?

"gay used to mean happy" (0.00 / 0)
but then they changed the meaning!  Oh noooo!  They snap up all the good words!
[ Parent ]
That goes with marrying dophins (0.00 / 0)
as one of my favorite comments of the day.
[ Parent ]
That group? (0.00 / 0)
OMG.
Terry and Caroline (0.00 / 0)
How can you not want these two cute older women, who have been together for 38 years, to be able to be married? How? It's like denying your grandmother something basic. I could never do that.
A beautiful couple (0.00 / 0)
I would pick them to drink a beer with!
[ Parent ]
New Thread!!! (0.00 / 0)
We're over 100 comments here, so join the discussion over in the new thread!

And kudos to Gems for her continuing great coverage from the scene!

Catholic Charities Adoption (4.00 / 1)
I'm no lawyer, but from what I understand of the Catholic Charities Adoption issues Brian Brown from the Family Institute of Connecticut brought up aren't exactly like he described.

The Catholic Charities can't just up and decide one day to start an adoption agency. It has to be licensed and regulated by Massachusetts as far as I understand.

  There was already 'Orientation Discrimation' law on the books and with the addition of same sex marriage law, to be licensed for an adoption agency in Massachusetts you have to have to abide by those laws and consider same-sex couples as adoptive parents.

I don't think anyone is denying the church to believe what they believe, but if they go to the state and ask to run a licensed, regulated agency, they have to abide by all the state laws just as any group or company does.

New Open Thread: Judiciary Committee Hearings on Marriage Equality | 118 comments
 
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